Minute 48: “Hey Mikey, I think he likes it.”

Transcript

Transcribed automatically from the audio, and imperfect for it — names and punchlines suffer worst. Useful for finding a moment, not for quoting one.

0:00Welcome to the Matrix Minute, a podcast where we discuss the first film one minute at a time because, you know, we just love this movie, man. Hi, I'm Phil, and I have trivia this time because I come in prepared all the time. Brad Pitt, suggested by the studio for the role of Neo. Suggested, but maybe not considered. Go on. Hello everyone, I'm Jake, and my tea is getting very cold. You just took a seat? Yes? Tea? Yeah, it sounded like you had a tip of tea. I did, it sounds like you had a sip of tea. I can prove it, wait. Slightly cold tea. Production value. You're Jake, aren't you? Yeah, I said that already. Oh, you are, okay, and with me is Tim.

0:41Hello. I'm Tim, and in Iceland, the movie had a translation of the title. It wasn't known as the Matrix, but Fylkj. Fylkj. Are you sure that's correct, Tim? That is correct, and it translates to the Matrix. The phonetics are correct, right? 100%. Yeah, I pressed on Google Translate the little button, and the robot told me. Perfect. 100% accuracy. And, of course, we are not alone once again, and with us is Patrick Willems, who's a filmmaker. He does stuff on YouTube. He does, like, I lost the description. I'm going to have to remember what to say, but, like... Can we just say he makes awesome stuff?

1:22Yes, he does. That's what I would say. And we're very happy to have him spend some time with us talking about three minutes for this whole week of the Matrix. Hello, sir. Hello. I am so happy to be here talking about a movie that I dearly love. Indeed. And we're so happy to have you. Very happy to have you as well. To talk about this with us. Yeah. And I want to start this because I forgot last time, but not this time. Patrick, we need to know, how did you first discover The Matrix, and what does it mean to you? The Matrix means a lot to me. It is sort of... It's the movie that I always tell people, and I mean, this is the truth.

2:03It's the movie that made me want to make movies. Sort of in the way that, you know, previous generations of people older than me, you know, they had Star Wars, and I love Star Wars, but The Matrix was the movie that came along right at the right time. It came out in... It was end of March 99, right? Yeah. Yeah. And so I was 11 years old, and it seemed intriguing. I was like into movies as an 11-year-old, and this seemed... It looked cool, and I saw the reviews were good because I would, you know, just like read the little Roger Ebert capsule reviews in my local newspaper. I was like, oh, this seems like a sci-fi movie, and good action, and mysterious, and references

2:48to Alice in Wonderland, but also it was rated R. And so I was like, well, I'm not even going to have to see it because it's an R-rated movie. And my parents weren't even really strict about that. They would show me R-rated movies at home without realizing it, but I just had been conditioned, I think, by society to not expect... To be able to see it. To be able to go see R-rated movies in theaters. But then when it came out on video, I remember asking my mom, I was like, mom, can you rent this? It got good reviews. I think we should watch it. Wow. Wow. Yeah. And she brought the VHS home one day, and I think I was just starting sixth grade, maybe. And it just, it was the greatest thing I'd ever seen.

3:33And then I would rent it again and again, and show it to my friends, and it was the first DVD I ever bought. Awesome. I later on bought the 10-disc Ultimate Matrix collection. That's a good one. That's a good collection. Yeah. Mostly because I wanted the remastered, recolor-graded version of the first movie. It was the first Blu-ray I ever bought. Ooh. I, and yeah, and it was as much, I'd already been interested in movies, but that was really the thing that got me, at first I sort of wanted to be a comic book artist, like in middle school. And then that quickly, you know, transitioned into just realizing that all my comic book ideas,

4:14I was more interested in skipping ahead to the film adaptations. And yeah, and it was really like, The Matrix kind of started all of that. I was just obsessed with it to no end. And so, yeah, it's had a big influence on my life. Not in the way that it's shaped the way I live my life, but it kind of started me, or it was a pretty big role getting me on the path to, I guess, that I've been on. Oh. So what are like some of the things that captivated you from The Matrix that you kind of took away that you sort of, that sort of stayed with you? Yeah. I mean, well, thinking back to when I'm 11, I have a very surface level reading of it, and it's just, oh, it's really cool.

4:54Oh, it's like everything looks cool. They wear cool clothes. The part where he like does the finger flick at the neck is cool. And so that was it. So early on, it was just, it was the coolest thing I'd ever seen. And then, and what was nice is as I studied film more and actually, you know, started making movies myself and studying movies in college and stuff like that, and just got a better understanding of the medium and all of that, I would always come back to The Matrix and see, oh, this really holds up. You know, I didn't just like it when I was younger. It really holds up. It is astoundingly well made.

5:36It's like a masterclass in, in action filmmaking and just an action storytelling. It has, I mean, I just think, you know, the way the plot unfolds is, is just, it's so brilliantly done the way it like, it keeps you asking these questions and, you know, plans just enough information to, to keep you, you know, like really invested. And, and, and really looking back now, one of the big things for me is I just, I love the way, and this is not a new thing to, to comment on, but I love the way that it just synthesized all these different things from different mediums and genres into this perfect, unique thing.

6:17And so like the way that the opening scene is pretty much, you know, it all begins in like classic, you know, like 1940s film noir, like all that visual language and, you know, nods to German expressionism and stuff like that. But then it adds in, you know, these, these action beats and, and shots that are right out of anime and comic books. And then you, and, and I, and I feel like you really get the John Woo stuff in the third act, but, but it's all these things that I, that, you know, I either loved at the time that I first saw it or came to love later. And it just, and I, I think kind of in the way that, you know, Star Wars was a big deal

6:58because it took Western elements and samurai movie elements and then sci-fi space office stuff and combined those, you know, the matrix synthesized several different things that were all cool on their own, but together it's like they were better than ever. It's the melting pot. It is, it really is. And, and yeah, and it's just, you know, I just think it's a magnificently put together movie that like, I love every shot in this thing. I could, I could, I mean, I'm glad you have this podcast because I really could just pick apart every minute of it forever. I love it. I was wondering, I think we never talked about this before, but I think it'd be a cool point

7:39to actually mention this. I was wondering the matrix, uh, like what's your take on sort of, you know, there's different styles of filmmaking, obviously. Yeah. And one is escapism, right? Sort of these sort of adventurous, something that's unworldly, right? And I think the matrix for me, at least it strikes a balance between that where it's, it is an escapist sort of film, but you have all these, like we talked about philosophical themes, religious themes. Right. And I was wondering, Patrick, if maybe you could comment on sort of something like that area on the philosophical elements. Sort of like, uh, like what's your take on, you know, this idea is the matrix and escapist sort of film or. That's a good question because there are a lot of different ways you can read this movie. And, um, and I have to say as much as I love it and have spent so much time thinking about

8:21it just over the past, you know, 18 years, um, I've never cared as much about the, the philosophical elements of it. And, um, you know, I, I appreciate that they're there and I like the way that they're like, you know, with elements of philosophy or same way as like the elements of religion, you know, are used as part of the overall storytelling. Yeah. Uh, that like that reading of it, um, has just, that's never been as interesting to me as, you know, as, as other aspects of it, but I do think, but yeah, but as a piece of escapism, it kind of, you know, it works perfectly just in the way that it, you know, it begins being

9:03like more or less in our world and then, uh, you know, following a, a more or less normal character. And, uh, pretty much everything fits into the late nineties definition of normal, you know, from like, uh, you know, his, his appearance to his name to his job and all of that. And then really cleverly like brings us out of that and, you know, escapes it, uh, into this like fantastical new world where, where anything's awesome. But Patrick, it's real. It's real. Yeah. I think that's what makes it really great that anyone, you know, even if your passion is just filmmaking, you know, the technical aspect of it or the philosophical stuff, there's, you

9:43know, something for everyone. And it's so, such a dense and packed movie that you can actually make this because we've been doing this and it was like, there's like 45 episodes and every minute had something. I mean, honestly, I didn't expect it to be this filler less. I'm also pleasantly surprised. You think we'd just be talking about beer for like a whole episode. Yeah, but it's true. There's always something that you can touch on. There's always something you can find that actually, you know, relates to some other idea or some other filmmaking reference and so on. And this is just crazy. Yeah. Before we, yeah. Sorry. Sorry. Go ahead. No, I just. Oh, continue. I was just going to say one of the really great things about it is how tight the movie

10:25is. Oh, yeah. And just there's a sense of, and I know, you know, looking back, I mean, we all have our feelings about the sequels, but, but one thing that, you know, the first movie has that those didn't, you know, the movie is, you know, the movie is, you know, the movie has been spent years planning out every microscopic detail of this. And so every shot has a purpose. There's no wasted time. There's no, no scenes or shot with just like, you know, just like standard coverage. It's like, you know, they, I mean, obviously we all know about, you know, this, the storyboarding and all that. And, you know, I own the art of the matrix book. I'm sure you guys might as well.

11:06And, uh, you can see the care that went into every second of it. And, um, and I think that that really matters a lot. And that's why it's a movie that's worth, you know, dissecting minute by minute. Yeah. Great answer. That's awesome. Uh, just want to say, before we get into the minute, I have a question for Patrick. And there's something that I've noticed, and this could be, you know, that sort of effect that, uh, we just been, you know, thinking and working with matrix for all the time. Now we see matrix everywhere, but do you think in your opinion, there's a sort of matrix revival sort of going on online? Because every other day I see something about the matrix. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Me too.

11:46Like on Reddit or somewhere. And this could be just because now I know. Yeah, yeah, I know. I think you're completely right because I've been thinking about this a lot and I've been, I've commented on it to, to friends of mine, because the thing is the matrix was such a phenomenon in the, you know, like early two thousands. And it was so influential and obvious. I mean, the matrix is one of those action movies where there's like a before and after like line in like cinema history. Definitely. I mean, before the matrix, I would say it was diehard that, you know, in terms of like immediately, if you look at the several years after there's the, Oh, there's everything that was influenced by it. And, and just one of those cultural shifts and the matrix had that.

12:29But then because I think of a combination of people getting sick of bad imitators and the sequels being generally being disappointing, it went, it became uncool very quickly. Right. And so by the time you got to, you know, 2005, like matrix references seem dated already. And, uh, things had moved on. Uh, at that point we, you know, the, the next sort of big, uh, action movie, uh, shift had happened with the born movies and that, you know, set sort of the new model for things. And so the matrix was, became the look of it references to what I feel went out of vogue for a while.

13:10Phased out pretty fast. It did. And you didn't see a lot of just people talking about it for a long time. And then I've noticed in the past couple years and, and happening more and more all the time that, uh, it seems to just get referenced more and people just talk about it more. And, uh, it's coming back into conversation because I remember when, uh, cause I made two videos on the matrix back in, it might've been April. I love them. Great. By the way. I love them. They're amazing. Yeah. Thank you so much. I really appreciate that. And I remember I'd been, you know, just kind of watching and, uh, and just like, you know, looking at the internet. I mean, I only started making video essays, uh, last November. And so, but I remember like kind of looking around at other video essays people had made

13:54and, uh, they're just like, you know, like videos that, that, you know, analyzing movies and stuff like that. I was like, there's nothing on the matrix. Okay. Somehow this is just, you know, untapped for some reason. Ah, so you started it a little bit. I mean, well, but, but I. It's your fault. It's all my fault. No, I mean, it had been back in the conversation, but there had been a lack of, you know, videos about it. Definitely. And so I was like, I think this is perfect because people haven't made these videos yet, but it's coming back into the conversation a bit more. And, um, and yeah, and it's funny, at this point, I feel like I've listened to just recently, uh, several other podcasts that were sort of, you know, revisiting, uh, the matrix and, and, uh, yeah.

14:35And, uh, and it just more and more, you know, you know, at this point, I feel like enough time has passed that it's coming back around and people are just like, wow, there, you know, that first movie is really just a masterpiece. Yeah. I'm actually, I'm actually really glad that it's coming back sort of into the conversation because I feel like it's been gone for such a long time, like out of the, at all discussion. And it's so, and it's so beautifully unique. Yes. And it's, it, it is a shame that it kind of faded out after 2005, just like you said. And I totally agree. Like Patrick Lee said, now it's only natural since it's been now what? True. 17, 18 years, I think we had plenty of time for sort of pan out and sort of see like what,

15:15what its place is in sort of, I guess, the history of, of cinema, I suppose. You could look at the trends of like fashion and everything. And it's, it's basically, you can see like 10 years ago, you know, when the sort of like the hipsters culture came out, everything was very eighties inspired, you know, and there was a rival of all those eighties cartoons and everything. And now it's sort of like five years ago, it was like the beginning of the nineties. And you can see even by fashion, I was just with my wife in a clothing store and I just saw some PVC black, shiny trench coats and all this like late nineties stuff. And I was like, it makes sense because right now our generation, and you were saying it was like 11 when you came out. So you're kind of close to our age. We are becoming the voices of, you know, what's in the public and our opinion is heard.

16:00And to us, that is nostalgia because that's from our childhood. Yeah. I think that's what it is. So, so, so, so our collective voice is kind of like bringing it up because. It's coming up to the surface a bit. Yeah, a bit. Yeah, definitely. And all those people who maybe saw it as a kid, they thought, okay, whatever, it was great. And then, you know, they weren't like obsessed about it as us, but it is still something that they saw as kids and probably spoke to them different levels. So now it's bringing it up to them. So everyone's like, oh yeah, the matrix. Yeah, exactly. And I don't think it's a coincidence that it was, I think kind of late last year that news broke of Warner Brothers potentially developing a new matrix movie. Right. Oh, they're listening. They're listening. I mean, and, you know, and this is a whole other conversation, but I think a non-Wachowski

16:44matrix movie is a terrible idea. But also, but we did reach that point where, you know, it is an IP and the studio, you know, decided, hmm, maybe now is the time people are like, are, are ready for, for things to come back. Yep. Yeah. It's like Power Rangers. Yep. Yeah. They'll kill it. They're in comparison. Maybe. I'm telling you, there'll be a Disneyland matrix. I don't know. There was a podcast. Oh, by the way. I'm a sentinel. Yeah. By the way, there was a podcast I was on just, what was it, like two weeks ago and talking about the matrix film and I, you know, the question came up that, um, like they asked me, um, what, uh, what do you think about the matrix, uh, reboot or something going on?

17:29And, uh, I have to say that like, I am not, uh, opposed to the idea, but I know that there's a huge and giant, uh, mountain to climb to get it anywhere close to what we got with, uh, when the Wachowskis were doing it because it was, it's coming from their mind. You know, this is us seeing the mind of the Wachowskis. Exactly. It is one of those things where, you know, like whatever you think of the sequels, this is all purely unfiltered their vision. Yeah. Yeah. I agree. Always has been. And, um, and not even like even more so than Star Wars because, uh, George Lucas didn't direct, uh, two of the original movies as much as he like, you know, kind of like controlled

18:12everything. And, um, and, but with this, it's like, you know, it really just feels to me that a non-Wachowski matrix is just going to be fan fiction. Yeah. Cause it sounds like the matrix movies are sort of in a sense, an extension of themselves. You know, they're putting themselves into the movie. And that's like a big difference when you do something like that versus working on a project where you have some involvement, I think. Right. So, yeah. And there's so much like the, the big part of it is the style and the way it was shot. So when you're remaking or rebooting, like, you know, if you, if you don't, usually it's a good idea. I feel like a great story or a plot and then you can remade it and you can upgrade it and you have something to work with. But as far as the plot, I mean, there's the great stuff about, you know, reality and that

18:56kind of the, the backbone of it. But honestly, a lot of it is just the style that makes the movie great. So if you lose that or change that, there's, there's not, you know, there's some room, a lot of room for failure. What do you guys think about the, the Animatrix in this sense? Cause that is taking the ideas. Oh, we're going into that. I'm just wondering, like in comparison to let's say like a remake, cause the Animatrix obviously isn't. But that was still supervised heavily by the Wachowskis. Yeah. And a lot of those were either written by, or like the story was by the Wachowskis. So it was still, it was still there. Yeah. I mean, it's still their overall vision and they're involved. Right. And, and the thing that seems to me most unappealing about a non-Wachowski matrix reboot, I assume

19:37it would still be a sequel. They wouldn't just start from scratch and remake it. Just remake it. That would be a sad day. That would be the worst. But, but, but I feel like it would spend a lot of effort trying to, you know, recreate the, the feel and the stuff that people liked. Well, I feel like if the Wachowskis were to return and make another one, they would be way more interested in trying to like take, you know, bring it forward and do new things and use another matrix movie as an opportunity to, you know, to create things we've never seen before. And I think other people would just be like, well, let's give them like the matrix stuff that they liked before. Yeah. And, and, uh, cause that's, again, you know, with the sequels, uh, you know, regardless

20:22of what you think of them, they were not interested in just doing the first movie again. No, not at all. No, no. That was a good thing. Wow. It seems to me like, I always wonder like with Wachowskis, you know, they made the first matrix film, but it does sort of feel like in one sense that they were also kind of waiting to just explore even more stuff, you know, like in a way. Yeah. It felt like that. It felt like. They had so much stuff that they're interested, especially at least from the idea side of things that they kind of wanted to get everything in there, but they couldn't do it in the first one. So they sort of set it up. I'm not saying the matrix is a set up movie. I'm just saying that perhaps in their approach, they were hoping to sort of. Yeah. They had quite a bit of material. Have these sort of, you know, even grander. Right. Ideas.

21:02Right. You know, I mean, you know, they, they kind of did the first, I guess, like transmedia thing where it's like, oh, we're going to, you know, use different mediums to all like, you know, this big story. And yeah. And which is, you know, more commonplace nowadays, like our variations on it, but it was a new thing back then. Definitely was. And yeah. And it's one of those things that I wonder about because for instance, I don't know if or when they're going to get a matrix size budget again, because their last several expensive movies didn't do. Yeah. Okay. Didn't do well financially. What was it? Jupiter ascending.

21:43And which to me is, it's maybe my least favorite Wachowski movie. And I think it's an interesting failure. But I haven't seen it. I mean, it's worth seeing if only for Eddie Redmayne's incredible performance. Yes. His bipolar. I mean, I just going. I mean, part of my issue with the movie is I think like he has exactly the right level of theatricality to what he's doing. That's not matched by the rest of the cast or playing it kind of naturalistically. I think he's phenomenal in that movie. But yeah. But I'm also, you know, on the record as being a huge fan of Speed Racer. Wow. Speed Racer. It's such a good movie. It's. I think it's such a good movie.

22:25I feel like that was so misunderstood. Oh, yes. So misunderstood. I mean, it was way ahead of its time. And that also bombed at the box office. And so I don't. I don't know when they're going to get a chance to make a movie of that scale again. But I still feel like there if they wanted to, if they could say, hey, Warner Brothers. We'll make another Matrix. Yeah. If they said just Matrix. Well, yeah. If they said. Send an email. Immediately. It would be just like pumping money. Yeah. Right. Yeah. Just like from all on. It's just like. Yeah. It's possible. Immediately. It's possible. Like 200 million will just go into our account. Of course. Yes. Why not? Of course. Of course. That's right. Exactly. So, yeah. Wow. This was an intro.

23:05I super enjoyed this intro. Amazing. Thank you so much, Patrick, for your insights. I apologize. That was probably far longer than it should have been. No, no. We're noticing that each of these intro episodes are getting longer. So it's totally fine. Yeah. Great. There's no rules here. Don't worry about a thing, man. Yeah. It's a world where anything is possible. Yeah. All right. So, minute 48. That's where we're on. Okay. And on minute 48, Tank brings Neo to one of the chairs and skips all the prerequisite operations program, opting instead to get straight into combat training, holding a small mini-disc-like device. On a screen in front of Neo, he reads jujitsu. Neo is indeed going to learn many martial arts as he gets a shock of digital knowledge zapped

23:49into his mind. The minute ends with more programs uploading. So, at the beginning of this scene, what I love the most in this minute is, obviously, Tank, very exciting time. And what I like about it is that it puts like a breath of fresh air into like the experience that we're going into. You feel like the atmosphere of the Nebuchadnezzar, for instance? Yeah, because like at the, you know, the previous scenes that we got, in the previous minutes, there was like heavy handed. It went from being really shocking with the revelation of the human batteries. And then later on with Morpheus talking about the prophecy of the wand and he has to get

24:29rest. Then Tank comes in and he starts lightening up the scene a little bit more. And that's great. And we get that good. I think this is a breath of fresh air just for the whole movie in general. And as much as, as great as it's been before this, because, you know, everyone has been pretty serious all the time. You know, oh, you know what all the performances are like. And Tank, and Tank shows up doing just having a completely different personality, like a radically different personality than every character that has appeared, you know, to this point. You know, no one, no one has talked like him or smiled as much as him. Yeah. Everyone else was a super serious all the time. And, uh, and now this guy shows up and giving.

25:12He's super excited. He, I mean, it's a very exciting time. But also it is a strange performance, but I, but I really like it. I think that's why it works though. Yeah. I mean, just, he has line deliveries that I don't think any other actor would deliver like that. Right. Yeah. And, uh, yeah, just like every little thing that he, like when he's sitting there at his little console, this is his casual little wink. And, um, yes, I've got to say, it also took me years to understand what he was saying when he says major boring shit. Really? Exactly. This is, this is, he's like, you know, major boring shit. And, uh, he says it in this odd way that, uh, I was like, I was never quite sure what

25:52he was saying there. Yeah. The accent. Yeah. He just had this, his entire dialogue since I was a kid. And since, because when I was a kid, I didn't understand English cause I grew up in Serbia. So I didn't get everything. I didn't have subtitles on the VHS I had. So like, I don't know. You probably don't have that. Maybe you have the different languages, but to me, English, there's like stages of English when I didn't understand anything was gibberish. And there's like the half stage when I was a little bit older, when it's like some words make sense and some is just like a vocal, like, like a, uh, like a vocal gibberish that I remembered how it sounds. This is the line that up until maybe a couple of years ago that I saw, I was like, oh, that's what he's saying. No way. I had no idea what it was saying. Nothing. It was just like, that's funny.

26:33You had the same experience. I mean, yeah, it's, it's, it's a weird, it's a weird delivery. And he just has this like, you know, sort of, uh, like he's all always ready to like almost burst with excitement, but he's, you know, speaking kind of quietly. And, uh, I also like how he's sort of like the cool pilot. You know what I mean? Like he's going to be, you know, directing. Yeah. He's in control. But he's the cool one. He's the cool one. And yeah. And also, cause he's, um, is he black and Asian? Yeah. I'm not actually sure. Where did you say he was from? You had a little introduction. Well, he was, he was adopted by, um. Oh yes. Um, Tommy Chong, I think. Right. Yeah. Chi-Chi Chong.

27:13I know he's his son. And, uh, but he just, he has a, you know, also a very interesting look. Indeed. And, uh, he's, he's just, you know, an interesting looking guy. He has an interesting performance. It's just, Tank is just, he's not like anyone else in this movie. And I think it's just, uh, the dynamic changes as soon as he comes in and starts talking. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. So does he, sorry. Do you guys think he's excited because, no, it was just, I probably had the same question. Do you think he's excited because he actually, you know, believes Morpheus and he's obsessed with the one? And, or he's just like, because he, he can't connect to the Matrix. So he can never experience what the Matrix is. Right. So his point of view is only through the monitors and, you know, what he sees.

27:56So to him, it's more like a stats kind of game. So is he really like, maybe he's excited that, okay, if he's the one, then this is going to be a bit of fresh air, like compared to these guys that I've seen, you know, in the Matrix. And they're just like, always do the same thing. It's like something exciting is going to happen. You know, like I get to, I get to, you know, like, like a hacker. It's like, I'm going to probably get to the. I think so. Oh yeah. He also strikes me as a, someone who is totally on board with what Morpheus is about because he didn't even have to leave the Matrix. He's believing a guy. Yeah. He's following a guy who was not born in Zion like him, who, you know, hasn't had as much time in the real world. And, uh, and yeah, no, and especially cause, you know, he's like the younger brother of

28:38Dozer. And so he's got that kind of like sort of somewhat youthful energy. And so to me, Tank is just, he's just all in. He's into the, the, you know, the prophecy. He's into just stoked to see what Neo can do. He's just, uh, I mean, yeah, he just, uh, he's into all of it. Ah, youth. And he also interestingly drops one of the only pop culture references in this whole movie. That's right. What was that all about? When he goes, this is, this is in the minute, right? He goes, Hey Mikey, I think he likes it. Which, and he was never in the Matrix. He's never seen that. Well, he might've seen that commercial via like watching a screen of code. Yeah. Just for everybody. Spying on someone on TV. Just for everybody who doesn't know.

29:19He's referring a commercial series for Life Serial, which, um, ran through the seventies and eighties. And, um, it's actually like, he likes it. Hey Mikey. And, um, it's, it's with this little kid who doesn't like anything. Give it to Mikey. Give Life Serial to Mikey. He doesn't like anything. And then he does. He likes it. Yeah. Classic commercial. And that means that in the world of the Matrix, the machines created the Life Serial commercials. There's, there's a lot of, uh, serial in this movie. I'm personally a fan of Serial. Yeah, Serial is, but. Let's just, let's just, let's just bring this back real quick. A lot of food. Because I, um, I mentioned, uh, way long ago, uh, we usually go into the 1996 draft and

30:02we talk about what's changed and I read a little bit from that. I've never read that draft. Dude. Oh my God. There's some nuggets. It's a gold mine. I didn't know it was available online. I found it and it seems to be legit. It's not like some, you know, it's, it feels Wachowski. So I believe it. I believe. Can you please send me a link after we finish recording? Absolutely. I have to read this. Yes. And just to give you a taste here, um, at the beginning when, um, the VO with, um, Cypher and Trinity is going as the codes were, um, uh, they're, they're spying on Neo and, uh, Cypher says. Opening scene, right? Yeah. Yeah. And they're actually talking about like the subject.

30:43What's, what's up with the subject? And then Cypher talks about what the subject is doing right now and he's buying Captain Crunch. And, and. Imagine Matrix starting with that. Yeah. You're talking about Captain Crunch. And a six pack as well. Of beer, right? Yeah. And. Does he eat the cereal, just like pours beer into the. Oh, gross. I think they're unrelated purchases. Unrelated. And. And they realize we would hate Neo if we saw him doing that. I wouldn't ever sympathize with him. And, uh, yeah. And then later on we have goop as well. So that's, that's kind of cereal. And then they start talking about tasty wheat and, uh, yeah, cereal is abundant in this film and I'm very happy because. Rooted cereal. Rooted in the picture. Yeah. This is just one of those things where whenever, you know, there's like a, a movie has its

31:27own mythology and creates its own world, but then they still include a pop culture reference. That's one thing that I'm always curious about. Because tasty wheat, that's not actually a real cereal, is it? Yeah. No. What is tasty wheat? I think tasty wheat is something that I only love from the Matrix. I always thought it was a made up oatmeal. Right. Because it's a reference to the stuff they're eating on the ship. But then later in the movies, they actually have. In Revolutions, yeah. In Revolutions, there's a poster. Yeah. Oh, yeah. It says tasty wheat. Right. That's a made up cereal. And so, and that's. Oh. But then also they're, what is it? On the TV in the Oracle waiting room, they're playing, what is it? Night of the Lepus? I think that's correct. The one with the bunnies. The old horror movie about the giant rabbits.

32:08And so that's, I mean, that's a pretty obscure pop culture reference. But yeah, but there are not many in this movie. And they're also telling us that, you know, the world is like, is fake. And so it's just, I'm totally overthinking this. But that's the thing that I have also, I thought about before just being like, huh. Okay, so there are fictional serials, but then also, you know, Tank is aware of a real life serial commercial. Which is called Life. So yeah, I guess it's a blend. It's a blend of. Or they have like, before the Matrix collapse, I had like in Zion, there's some VHS they found. Oh, yeah. It's his favorite thing as a kid. He would just watch those commercials on the VHS. Over and over and over.

32:48So he keeps saying these references and no one on the Nebuchadnezzar knows what he's talking about. You know what? That is the stuff I wish we got more of in some sort of spinoff comics. Yeah. Just like the stuff about regular people in Zion, especially because one of my issues with the sequels is I just never give a shit about any of the Zion stuff or any of the characters there. No, they're just parting and grinding on each other. And they spend a lot of time, especially in the third movie, like. I was going to say, the third movie is like pretty much only Zion. Right. And so. That's my only thought of Zion. That's it. Just naked people. But I and but if we saw stuff like, oh, like kids in Zion, like, you know, finding old remnants of, you know, human society and and like getting into those, that would be really

33:34interesting to me. Yeah. And I would care so much more about the people if there were stuff like that. Yeah, exactly. Which made me think that there might be another aspect to to this tank character. Maybe he was just assigned to the ship and he was so bored with everything because it's the same stuff. All the like, oh, the prophecy. He's got someone new and he's finally excited to run these little programs like, oh, totally. Totally. In my work, like something new. And it's it's the one it's the, you know, someone important that they picked up. It's not just, you know, another. Yeah. He's going to be awesome. Yeah. He's going to be awesome. We're going to we're going to juice him up with all this amazing fight programs. Yeah. Also, Tank is he's pretty buff, though.

34:15Look at that. Look at that shoulder. And dude's got some free time. You know, he's not in the Matrix all the time. So, yeah. So he could he could totally like take Neo in the real world. Oh, for sure. Oh, yeah. We could take Neo. Neo is just like a little bit of acupuncture. That's not going to. Yeah. It's not going to help too much. Right. That's right. Imagine that. Just like. Who knows? Maybe he's been doing his sit ups. Yeah, maybe. Faithfully. Hey, who knows? Here's the question. So he's learning all these programs. Do you think he knows that in real life, though? Oh, man, this is this is a can of worms. The age of old, yeah. We're going to open many more times. Next episode. We'll open this next episode. Let's do that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Let's just talk about. Let's leave that can closed for now. Yeah. Let's leave it wiggling. Yeah. As it tries to escape. But.

34:55Tank just sits in. You remember, he just goes. We got to get to it, right? And he jumps on this chair. And he jumps on this chair. A subtle little sound edit. Just like as it cuts into that. Oh, yeah. Oh, let me hear that. Let me hear that. We got a lot to do. We got to get to it. Oh, man. We never noticed that. Wow. I mean, well, I'm the guy who made a whole video about the transitions in the Matrix. That's right. And there's little things like that. And yeah, just that cut to just like jumping right into the chairs. And I think it's really effective. That little sound edit, I think. Oh, it's perfect. Adds, you know, a bit of energy to things. And the fact that it was so not noticeable tells you it was effective.

35:39Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Yep. Didn't notice until now. That's so good. It's 18 years. It just keeps it moving. It's like a fast train. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Because you've got the sound edit and it cuts on the movement into him, like jumping into the chair. So it's great because it goes from like them being kind of talking quietly in this cramped room, very static shots. And then immediately, you know, energy in the audio, energy in the visuals. It's great. Yeah. Yeah. No, we're so glad to have you because some of these details just fly sometimes right above our head. Yeah. I was watching your video. And I actually went to the movie to check out those shots. Like, you're right. Like, that's so well done that after watching it a hundred times, I did not notice it because you're just, it's impossible to, like, we watch these when we do these podcasts just

36:22to see the minute selling this for the audience. And every time I play that minute, I forget. And I'm like, oh, the minute's over. Like, every single time I want to watch the movie till the end. It's just, it's great. Yep. I wanted to ask, we have one really big question. He's like, got to start with these operation programs first. Yeah. What do you think those programs can be? Because I have no idea. Oh, well. Because they're fine to skip. Well, they're fun to skip. They're fine to skip, clearly. Right. So I'm wondering, I mean, does he, well, do they go back and do them later? Maybe they do that. It's obviously off screen because we never get to see that.

37:04Right. But like, I would imagine that's like, you know, when you start a video game and you have like the basic controls. Oh, like a tutorial? Yeah. Like a tutorial. And it's like, maybe, maybe it's like disorienting. Well, no, because he is from the Matrix. Maybe it's like perspective tests and. I was thinking it might be some kind of like, what's that word I'm thinking? Physiology tests for the virtual world. Something like that. Because later on. Something like that. Like configuring your, oh, you could like choose your avatar. But see, this is the thing though, but if Tank is skipping the configuration program, that's all it is. It's pretty terrible. Because what if he's, it's not going to. Nose slider, ear slider. I mean, he says operation programs.

37:44What does that mean? I don't know. Operations. I, I'm not really sure. Yeah. But yeah. Tutorials are kind of what I always imagined are just like getting to know like how to, how, you know, how to move around and exist and like, like, like just like the rules of the world basically. Yeah. Or like the. Or like the. Boring documentation. Yeah. Right. In the Matrix, phone, phone booths are used for. There you go. There we go. Stuff like that. Cell phones are used and then you go pick up the phone. Yeah. Right. Put the phone back. Oh, yeah. It could be like that. Like those like. Right. Or maybe like in the Matrix, some things don't work. You can spot a cat. And you know what I mean? Yeah. So it's great that Tank just keeps throwing them from, you know.

38:26More fun this way, man. Yeah. Just. He knows how to handle his clients. Yeah. Combat training. Jiu Jitsu 2.0. Drunken boxing. That was my training. But real. Drunken boxing is real. Yeah. As an actual like fighting style? Drunken boxing. I mean, you know. Okay. Oh, okay. Haven't you seen the Jackie Chan movies? Drunken Master. Drunken Master. Yeah. This is. It's on my notes. We. I hope like. Because I am so. I haven't seen a bunch of Jackie Chan films. But I am. I have no information about Kung Fu movies. Yeah. We're kind of. I wouldn't be able to tell you nothing. We're knowledgeable on a superficial level. I would say. I mean. I'm not an expert by any means.

39:06But. But the. The Jackie Chan. One of his. Very early. Like breakout hits was. Drunken Master. And then. But the sequel. Which is one of his finest films. Drunken Master 2. I think it's also sometimes. It's called. The Legend of Drunken Master. That. Yeah. I mean. And there's the ones where he actually. Gets drunk. And fights better. And so. So he'll be like. Pouring like. Liquor down his throat. In a marketplace. And then like. Amazing. I'm looking at it. Yeah. And he'll just. You know. Be like. You know. Stumbling around. With his goofy smile on his face. And then just like. Destroying people. It's. It's great. And yeah. So.

39:47The movie's about drunken boxing. Yeah. There you go. And. Great reference there. With drunken boxing. Drunken Master. Was directed by. I think. Yan Wu Ping. Yeah. So. Yeah. All comes around here. Good old. He's the martial arts choreographer. I was going to say. Yeah. I was going to ask. Oh yes. He directed a lot of classic martial arts films. Right. And like. Iron Monkey. Yes. That's the one. We love that one. Iron Monkey. Remember. With Donnie Yen. And. It's. Oh man. It's been a long time though. It's been a while. I'm talking to Jake. Because we're in the same room. So I'm like. Hey. Yeah. Remember that. You guys can see each other. We're. The other village realm. Yeah.

40:27Sorry. He did. He did a lot of stuff. I mean. He's obviously choreographed a ton of stuff. But then. But yeah. But then he's just like directed a lot of martial arts movies. Yeah. And. He recently did the. The movie that I'm probably never going to watch. The. The sequel. To Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon. Oh. He did that one. It was a sequel. Okay. Yeah. And Michelle Yeoh came back. Donnie Yen is in this one. It's also in English. That's right. I saw the trailer. And I was. Can I just say that I watched a year. Video essay on that. And I. It was awesome. I super enjoyed it. Thank you so much. That's all I wanted to say.

41:07And. Yeah. That's one of my favorite movies. Because the movie that we actually. Coincidentally. Also. I don't know if you grew up with it. I can't. I can't remember. But we kind of grew up with it. And it's strange. Because it's not. Necessarily like a movie that we ever really rewatch. But it's always been kind of embedded in our memory. Yeah. Every time we watch. We're so familiar with it. Yes. Right. And yeah. That's one. That's all. Part of the reason that I made the video. Was because. That movie was a very big deal. In the early 2000s. I mean. It's still. The highest grossing. Foreign language film of all time. And. You know. Like won a bunch of Oscars. And stuff like that. And no one talks about it anymore. Yeah. Yeah. And that was. It was like. It was a. Yeah. And it was like a very significant movie.

41:49That everyone was at least aware of. And. And so yeah. That's why I was like. Why doesn't anyone talk about that movie? It's. It's really great. I'm going to make a video about it. Yes. So. But yeah. You're going to see it popping out everywhere. Yeah. That's right. Of course. That's it. That's it. Yeah. I'm. That's going to do it. I'm shifting cultural trends. Yeah. You too. Yeah. And. But no. Wo Peng was. You know. Obviously the fight choreographer on that. And. And then directed a sequel. That they made for. Like for Netflix. Yeah. And. That. I. I'm just not interested in seeing. Yeah. I know Kung Fu. Wait. That's in the next one. Isn't it? Yeah. Oh. Well. Maybe we should. With that. We should just.

42:30There's one last thing. Is there anything else we can add? Before we finish. He has. That I wanted. There's a line that I prefer to I Know Kung Fu. At least. When I was in middle school. I would quote it more. And I just really love. Jiu Jitsu. I'm going to learn. Yeah. Jiu Jitsu. And just his like. Slight disbelief. And his very. Yeah. You know. Keanu underplayed excitement. Yeah. And. I. I love it. That. To me. Is such a cool line. Also. One of my favorite. Sorry. I. You guys have had. You know. Like 48 hours. To talk about this movie. But. Yeah. I try to like. Make the most of my time. Please. I'm loving this. This is awesome. I love. The.

43:11Just the. What. The effect they do. For when he's getting the first program. Oh. That's right. Yeah. Yeah. Because. The little wiggling. Yeah. Because we already had the part. When he. You know. Goes into the construct. For the first time. And that like. Piercing. High pitched. Sound. Right. But here. We get a similar thing. And. But we're actually. We don't cut away. We just hold. On. Like him. Getting. And you. And it like. When you think like. What must be like. To just. Cram. In. In. Three seconds. An entire. Skill. That people. Would have to train. For years. To learn. Into your brain. And it's like. Yeah. It's probably kind of like that. It's this like. You know. Pretty much. Like.

43:51Like. You know. Really intense. Just like. Searing. Sound. And like. Painful thing. And just like. Yeah. The whole frame. Shakes. Like. That's probably done. Post-production. And. And just like. And yeah. And just. You know. He's in pain. And then there's like. You know. He's like. Snaps. It's like. Over so fast. I just. I love that effect. And it's just. Totally. It communicates so much. So efficiently. And. Because. Yeah. It's like. It's kind of funny. Because this is the first time. We see that. And. You know. Other movies. Would devote. You know. 15 minutes. To a training montage. And here. It's like. The world's fastest. Training montage. It's just.

44:31And they found a way. To communicate it. So efficiently. I just. It's great filmmaking. I think it's so cool. Absolutely. Yeah. The. The. The sound. Especially. It's like. It mimics that sort of. Really strong headache. When you. When you sound. Like. Just like. Your ears. Like pop. And you can't hear anything. Well you know. It's funny. And I love it. Go ahead. That. It's like. It's like. It ends. It's. You know. You can clearly see. He's like. It's that pain. But. You actually see the result. Like. He can. He can feel the result. Yes. I was going to say that. He's absolutely like. I can handle that. I like that it's sort of like. A good pain. In a way. You know. By the end. Well you know. It's not orgasmic. We don't want. No. No. Speaking of which. I'm saying like. Where he went through this. Like.

45:12Momentary. Momentary pain. But at the end. He realizes. Like you said to him. Like. Okay. Now he knows something. And it's like. Yeah. You can do it again. But. What the best thing about this is. That I wanted to bring up. Is this. Is one of the first. I think. Scenes. In a classic. One of the early. Sort of. Internet videos. That I had downloaded. On my computer. And is the. I don't know if you ever seen this. Patrick. But this is old school. Did you ever see the. Matrix fart video? No. No way. I did not. Because this is the first. This was. I don't think so. I may have. Like. Way back in the day. But I don't remember it. This is the first one. We'll link it up. But essentially.

45:52It's farts. Sound of farts. Like. Incorporated into some of the scenes. And this is the first one. It's so stupid. It is extremely stupid. But. It works. So well. We'll link it to you. You can watch it. But this is the first one. When he's done. Like. When it ends. And there's. This fart. And then it continues with other scenes. So. I can see that. Definitely people. Look it up. You might. You know. Saw this long time ago. That was something we used to watch when we were kids. Over and over and over and over again. It was just so funny. Yeah. Because it was the Matrix. That's right. With farts. Anything that's the Matrix. And. I think that's about all we can say. Unless anyone else has more thoughts. We can go to. Patrick. Anything else? I will say.

46:32I love. The. I mean. Obviously. All the design work in this movie is great. But I love. Just. The look of like. The computer programs that they have. With like. The spinning CGI brain. And stuff like that. Yeah. It's really a shame that they didn't. Include those. In the DVDs. As bonus materials. Or anything. They're really cool. They've. They've. They've got the touch screens. And all that. But it does. Like. They actually look like. Because I mean. It's weird. Because in the world of this movie. You know. It's like. Way in the future. And. But they still. Have this. Kind of like. Thrown together. Technology. And. I think the computer screens. And like. The displays. On them. They actually do. Kind of strike this balance. Where it.

47:13It seems like. You know. You get. It seems very functional. And not like. You know. The design isn't flashy. But. But it's also. Because we didn't have. Touch screens back then. And. And so. Yeah. It's like. Like. I believe it. When I. When I look at those. I'm like. Yeah. That. That makes sense to me. And. I also just. The rotating brain. On the right. Is. Epic. It's great. And there's like. A little skeleton there. A little. Neo. Yeah. And also. Just like. The little. Like. The. The thing. That the screen is on. There's like. A burn. Next to it. And just. All this damage. Everywhere. Just like. We called it. We called it mold.

47:53I think. Yeah. Just like mold. We don't know. This one just worn out. This one. The one when you see the whole monitor. Like. The one on the left. Just like. Worn out weather. Yeah. Yeah. It's totally moldy. The one on the right. It looks like a burn. I just can't believe I never saw. Neo's skull feet. Yeah. Oh yeah. They're amazing. A little. A little duck feet. It's amazing. Yeah. All the design is great. And I love. Because at the. At the end of this minute. And. Once he's like. Hell yeah. You know. We go into this kind of montage. Of him just learning more and more. Fighting styles. And I love how we get. You know. Like this music kicks in. This. It's kind of like. You know. Like metallic pounding. Which is.

48:34And I. Yeah. It's like. There's that. But then with these like. Like. Just like. Kind of like. Rhythmic. Like. Just like. Bang. Bang. Just like. Oh yeah. The anvil. Yeah. The anvil. And the same. It's like. Very reminiscent of the music. That we get. In the transition. Into the government lobby scene. And it's like. Neo's entering. That's a good point. Yeah. It reminds me of the. The Terminator theme. Because you have. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. The metallic banging going. You know. With. Especially in the Terminator 2. That. Yeah. That anvil. Yeah. The anvil. So. So it fits well. He's a machine. He's learning. He's a machine. Which is. In the next minute. Yeah. Yeah. So. All right.

49:14With that. I'll have to say. Wow man. Talking a lot in this episode. That's pretty cool. I want to say. Thank you so much. Patrick. For being on. On. Our. Matrix Minute podcast. Oh. It's been a pleasure. Will you be able to join us. For at least. Two more episodes. To just round out the week. I think so. I mean. You know. You know. I've done one. I might as well do a couple more. Yeah. That sounds like a. Like a good plan. Excellent. It's a good plan. The way you sound excited. We might not be able to get rid of you. Do you want to be a permanent co-host? Is it? You can be. It's true. I mean. I mean. It's like you said. You know. When you try to watch a minute. You can't stop. You know. I've talked about a minute.

49:55And I was like. I just. There's. I just want to talk about it all. I mean. Yeah. We got so much good stuff in store. That's right. So. You can find. Us. Oh no. I mess this up all the time. Whenever I plug my own thing. You can find us on. You're a bad beggar, Philip. I know. I'm terrible. The Matrix Minute. One. That's the one. Yes. That's the website. Then you can go to our Facebook group. Which. No. No. The page. The page. Let's just do this. Someone else do it. I can't do it anymore. Let's just do this. If we missed something. Which you probably didn't. Because Patrick is amazing. But if we did miss something. Let us know in the comments section. Of the announcement post. For this episode. Which is episode 48. Perfect. If you don't want to write on Facebook.

50:35You can also email us. At ask. At the matrix minute dot one. Yes. And finally again. Thank you Patrick. And if you want to. Where can we find Patrick? If you want to plug your stuff. And check out your stuff. Yes sir. Pretty much all my stuff. Is available. At youtube.com. Slash Patrick H. Willems. That's P-A-T-R-I-C-K. H. W-I-L-L-E-M-S. And then I'm on. All the social medias. At Patrick H. Willems. Fantastic. Wonderful. And we will catch everyone. And thank you listener. For listening. Thank you listener. And we'll catch you in the next episode. Thanks guys. Goodbye. Bye. Bye.

51:15! Thank you.