Minute 105: “There is no spoon.”

Transcript

Transcribed automatically from the audio, and imperfect for it — names and punchlines suffer worst. Useful for finding a moment, not for quoting one.

0:00Welcome back to the Matrix Minute, a podcast where we discuss the first film one minute at a time! Welcome back. It's nice to be back. Into your speakers, into your ear holes as we speak about the Matrix. No guest today, but I've got myself. We got Phil. Good. We got Phil. Yes, we do. Let's do this. Welcome, everyone. Welcome. How are you doing? We welcome all of you, one and all. Welcome. We are glad to have you here. You know other minutes by movies, minute movie, web podcasts, they always go like,

0:41we take it one, and then you put it like a pun, like one bullet dodging minute at a time. That's true. That's true, but... We are not punsters. We're not punsters. Is that a bad word? No. That's true. It doesn't... I didn't know what it was, so I'm afraid sometimes when I... That's why I don't use words that I don't know the meanings of, because you might use it, and then you find out later it's like, you know... Or... I don't know. You never use it, and you invent it, and then you become the inventor of punsters. They hate you when you invent words. I don't know why, though, because I love when people invent words. Why not? Go ahead. So that's not a word. But some words are cool when you make them up.

1:24Okay, that's an insult. Suck my unit. Listen, listen. I want to talk to the listener. Oh, here we go again. Here we go again. Let's get close. Pull up your chair, listener. Yeah, yeah, pull up your chairs. Hello. And I'd just like to welcome you back to the Matrix Minute. I hope you've had a good time in your life, and if you haven't, I would like to say that I'm there for you, and I care about you. Even though I don't necessarily know you personally, I can tell you that it gets better. It gets better. And don't worry about it. The good thing is that you're here with us, which means that you can hang out and listen to us talk about the Matrix.

2:05And isn't that a good thing? Yeah. Come on, we have to agree. It's a good thing. Yeah, yeah. It's good to be with friends. It's good to have hearing. Yeah, it is. It's good to have hearing. Hearing? Yeah. That is true. That is true. By the way, do you think like... I think we're going to offend someone if this ever gets transcribed and someone's reading it. If you were deaf in the real world, would you be able to be able to hear in the Matrix? Yes. Why do we offend someone? What do we do? You know, someone can't hear? Well, this is what I was wondering. I wouldn't listen to the podcast. Well, I'm saying like later on it gets transcribed, they're reading it, and they're like, ugh. Yeah, but the thing is that I think that a person who... We just lost it. A reader. Jacob. Reader. I just want to say that I don't think anyone would take that offensively.

2:47I don't think so. No, I'm joking. I'm joking. Because I think you didn't mean it in bad spirit. You just meant it like, you know, in general. Anyway. Welcome. What a way to start. Yeah, the Matrix is a great film. What a way for me to screw up your lovely message. I apologize. Yeah, Tim. Why are you ruining my messages? I was being so nice. Yes, you are. Minute 105. Hello, listener. I was being really nice, I think. And Tim comes up, right? Wouldn't you agree with me? Yeah, yeah. Tim comes up and he's like making fun of people. Exactly. If they have impairments. I deserve to be spanked. That's the worst. Yeah, well, Trinity has an impairment in this one. What's her impairment? She can't dodge bullets. Hmm. Oh. That's true. That's the worst kind of impairment. Am I really loud? Am I really loud today? No, you're fine. Okay. Like, I'm saying level-wise. Well, this is Minute 105.

3:29So, we went through the lobby scene with Crystal Beth. I should have asked her if she's ever listening. Is that her real name? I don't know, but it's everywhere. Yeah. So. Always wanted to know. So, yes. And we went through that. We were successful. And now, we stopped where Neo's looking up at the ceiling. At the stars. Yeah. At night. You know, like in Lion King with Timon and Pumbaa? But it's Morpheus. Oh, you mean like Timon and Pumbaa? Not Morpheus. Don't ruin the mood. Trinity. Morpheus. Oh, Trinity. Well, no. Because like, you have Simba's Neo.

4:10Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Timon is Trinity and Pumbaa is Morpheus. Yeah, you're right. And they're laying on the ground. I think Pumbaa is Trinity because. Pumbaa is Trinity. Because the meerkat, Timon, is the instigator of stupid ideas. That is true. I'm sure that's Morpheus' thing to do. And they're looking at the stars and Morpheus is like. No, not Morpheus. They're fireflies. He's like. Okay, this is going nowhere. Up in that big blueish black thing. I had nothing. I always thought they were bowls of gas burning billions of miles away. Oh, he's above gas. Tim, do you like Lion King? Yeah, I haven't seen it in a long time. I might. Maybe. I don't know. I definitely like the visuals.

4:52I guess. I don't know. I haven't seen it in a while. I probably like it. You should watch Confused Matthew's review of the Lion King. He hates that movie. Why? I don't know. You should watch it. It's like Pumbaa and Timon are the biggest villains. Oh, it's one of those? It's one of those Morpheus kind of guys? It's not. Yeah, but it's more like. Why? You know. You should just watch it. It's not like game theory or movie theory. It's. He's honestly just doesn't like the movie. Okay. Um, there is no spoon. Why would it be game theory? I remember learning about that. Why game theory? I don't know. Okay. Anyway. Yeah. Read us.

5:33Read us. I imagine you might feel like Alice. Tumbling down the rabbit hole or the other hole? The what other hole? Hey, just Alice. Can you specify what this other hole is? I was going to say the meerkat hole. Yeah, yeah. Maybe that's a little. Maybe that's a little weird. The meerkat's hole. Yeah. Yeah. Let's not. Let's not tumble down there. No, I think that's not. But Philip, can you read us a passage? And can you. Dodge. Okay. Can you tuck us into the bed? Dodge this. As you read. Yes. Like. Yeah. Do a. Do a freaking. What's the. What's the. What's the comedian guy who does the. The voice of the parrot. Jafar's parrot.

6:15What's his name? Do we do. Do we do. Godfrey. Something. Godfrey. Godfrey. I don't. I don't even know how I can do that. You just have to really like. Yeah. It's like another caliber. I'm so. No. I can't. It's just. Move a little away from the mic. Really loud. It's just way too loud for me to do that. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Let's just not. Neo whispers as he looks on top. I can't do it. Let's not. Let's not. Let's not Godfrey it up here. Let's just go. Let's go smooth. Let's do. ASMR. Do ASMR. What if. ASMR. There is no spoon. Neo whispers as he looks up to the tall shaft leading to the top floor. And he shoots the restraints of the elevator, dropping it while both he and Trinity are pulled

7:00up at high speeds. The elevator with the bomb hits the floor and explodes, showering the whole laundry with debris and flames. The agents get wet as the sprinklers are ignited. Oh my goodness. The agents get wet as the sprinklers are ignited. Philip. Philip, what are you reading? This is. This was not intentional. Smith tells both of the others to find them and destroy them. I repeat. We are under attack. Neo and Trinity are kung fu-ing guards on the rooftop and take them out with style.

7:40Trinity throws a knife. Agent Jones takes over the pilot and walks towards Neo. Philip, what kind of stuff are you into? It's your fault. I was going to write. I thought this was. Is this your latest novel? That was perfect. That you've been reading? It couldn't have gone better. Yeah. Someone's fantasy just got fulfilled. Wow. Wow. Someone just was waiting for this day. If you're like a fan of the Lord of the Rings audiobook, Dying by Philip, this is your lucky day. Oh no. I mean, come on. That's Shaft. That's the beginning. What was that? The Shaft was like the, that was the first. Gotten down the first board. I was thinking about what do you call it? Like, you can't call it anything else.

8:21There's something, you know, like it's a big building. It's an elevator shaft. There's an elevator shaft. That's true. What else can it be? Like a tower? You can't say tower because they're inside the building. The elevator hole. Yeah. You could have went with that. That sounds great. That would have also panned out the same. Okay. Well, now that we're done with that, thankfully, let's get on to talking about this minute. Sorry. Sorry. There's like a Simpsons episode. Ooh, garage. Ooh, la la, fancy man. It's like, what do you call it? Car hole. This will forever go into the best ofs. Okay. Automatically. The Matrix fantasy.

9:02But it's very, it's very also bizarre and all kinds of violence in there. I don't, I don't like that. It's good. It's a mix of everything. This is just like what we were talking about with the preacher. That is true. It was a pretty good minute though. Yeah. This is a great minute. There's a bunch of stuff we can talk about. True. So this is a pretty good minute. Action packed. There's millions of things we can talk about. So Neo's looking up at the shaft. Ah, yes. The shaft. What else can you say? The chute. The giant chute. The chute. The cavern above. What about, what about vertical tunnel? The vertical tunnel. That's pretty good. That's cool. That's pretty, yeah, right?

9:43You're not thinking of anything. The V tunnel. Yeah. Tell it, you had to go there. No. Enhancing the words. No. Does this come out on Valentine's? No, it doesn't. Anyway. The Valentine's Day tunnel. The Valentine's tunnel. Yeah. Valentine's Day tunnel. Wink, wink. Okay, so. Valentine's tunnel. It's quite up there. Quite up there. Tim, you were commenting earlier while we were watching a minute. And you said that the magic's gone. Yeah. This is close up to Neo. You can see Neo's sunglasses and you can see his eyes through his sunglasses. Could you, you know, comment on that? Well, the shape of his glasses is kind of, you know, it's a bit different. It's a little bit cat eyes.

10:24And once you can only see the glasses, it kind of adds a cool, you know, expression to his face. Like kind of, I don't care. But in this scene, they're very see-through. You can see his eyes. And basically, they lose all the coolness. They look like grandma glasses to me for some reason. Hmm. Yes. I see your point. And it's like, you know, the coolness is gone. You can see the fear in his eyes. I mean, it makes more sense, but. Yes. I mean, I think that, how could they? Yeah. I think. Yeah. I don't know. Do you think that was intentional or was just like? You know, I don't know. It reminds me of Darth Vader. Darth Vader. Do you know the story about Darth Vader? Yeah. He was Anakin.

11:04He was the tale of Darth Plagueis. And all the younglings and like, and all the sand people. Yeah. Yep. You pretty much. Because he doesn't like sand. He's like, you're sand people. I don't like sand. Yeah. So that's the story of Darth Vader. Racist. But another story, less known story, is the one that has to do with the, the on-set costume of Darth Vader. Okay. Okay. And, um, you know, do you know the, uh, the eye pieces for the Darth Vader costume? Mm-hmm. What? They're like red or something? Yeah. They're brown, which is interesting. Wow. Phil knows this. Phil, you talk. They're more of a crimson. You've read all three volumes. Yes. Rinsler's. Is that his name?

11:44J.W. Rinsler. His making of books. He was on Indiana Jones Minute. Really? Yeah. That's amazing. Yeah. So why can't you educate us on Darth Vader's eyepieces? Okay. Well, Darth Vader's eyepieces were a very dark crimson-y color. Um, that's because, uh, that's the darkest they could find. And they were hoping that the, uh, lenses wouldn't pick up that, you know, red that would show up on, you know, as the light goes through it. Sadly, there's a few shots where you can really see David Prowse's eyes underneath the helmet in some shots. When he's talking to Tarkin specifically, the light shines through. Yes.

12:24And, uh, they decided, decided to exploit that in Rogue One in an extreme measure, which was, you know. Uh, yeah. Oh, they like deliberately made him like, you know, orange. Yeah. And then they got the costume completely wrong. But anyways, coming back to that, that was the side story. That was. Wonderful side story. Since we're talking about the sunglasses, I can give you some trivia on that. Yeah. Gimme, gimme. Give us the trivia. All right. Well, that's an Australian local company called Blind, Blinde? Blind. Blinda. Yeah. And they, and they make their own sunglasses. So they actually had to, they had to go and, um, go into a bidding war to beat out the

13:10bigger guys, you know, like you can, you can guess. Ray-Ban. Um. Or, or which other ones are there? I don't know. I don't know. Ray-Ban. Dolce & Gabbana. I don't know. So those big guys. Yeah. Those. Oakley? Yes. Yes. Oakley. And those big guys because. Annie Oakley? Because they would actually be the ones to produce that, but they wanted to produce it themselves. Here's my question for you. And they actually got to, they got, they got it right. They got it working. My question is. Nice local Australian. How would these companies bid for a movie they don't even know? Yeah. No one, I don't think anyone ever. I think they watched it. I think they watched some clips of it. They have to. That would make sense. And they could watch, uh, there might be a little bit of a, uh, uh, press junket sort of package for people to, who are interested.

13:52Wait, wait, wait. Or looking at storyboards or stuff like that. People have to be able to see that. But like, what's the benefit? Because I've never went, oh, let's get Blondie glasses. I don't think anyone ever knew that Blondie was. I think this is the nature of even subtle product placement. Yeah. Yeah. That's how it is. Because I think they're. But how would you then buy it? I don't think. You know that they are the ones who actually produce it. You can actually buy it from Blond. That's what I'm saying. But I guess maybe I was too child. Like, I don't think my brother went, oh, look at Blondie. He was just like, I'll just get glasses that are blue. And this is Matrix. I think here's my take on it. Right. Right. I don't think it's necessarily so much about selling sunglasses. I think it's them just making sure that their product is in more places as possible.

14:34I guess. Creating a sense of like, you know, we make premium products. Yeah. Look, you can get the perception that, look, Neo is the one. Yes. And he's shooting all these people and his sunglasses. I think that's the whole idea. Yep. So if you're really curious. Just a good image. Yeah. You can find out about them. You'll go, ah. Do you think they had rights for promotional material from the Matrix? Like, put, like, oh, look, look, it's Neo. Like, put Neo picture and it's like on their store. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I bet. They have official Matrix glasses. Yeah. Do they have also Trinity's and everything? Yeah, yeah. They made all of them. That's awesome. And what's great about it is that they. Can we get them? Yeah, you can. I think it's out of print at the moment. Let's look at the prices. This is a podcast about prices. We talked about one time about the steaks. That's what we do all the time.

15:15Yeah, we talked about the steaks, right? At, what was it? Restaurant 41. Yeah. And, which is gone. So I will give you guys an idea. But I want to say that all the glasses were custom made to fit the actor's noses and ears. So all of them are pretty good. And IMDb trivia is wrong. Once again, I want to reiterate that. Even though Cypher has square glasses, Mouse does as well. So it doesn't make any sense. Oh yeah, the depth of nonsense are wrong. Do you know what the model is called, Philip? Just write Neo glasses. Oh, I thought it was like a special name.

15:55Like, enter Mr. Hat. T5. You go blind or blind or blind matrix Neo sunglasses. It's a minimum order of 600 pairs. I don't think we need that much. I know, looking at the different site. Oh, look, here we go. Overstock.com. What about blindday.com? But look, there's a website that takes me, the first one on Google is matrixeyewear.com. Is there a Mac Keeper commercial there? It's the crappiest website. Yeah, it looks pretty bad. I don't think Blind produces them anymore. Well, if you want to get them from Blind, you can get them on overstock.com. And they'll run you 50 US dollars.

16:38Those are not the real ones. The real ones are about 200. Where did you find that? On eBay. On eBay. It's too bad, so they don't make them anymore, I guess. Yeah, maybe even if Matrix is popular again, it'll be like, I'll reissue. Well, no, when the end of the 90s is popular again, so that's when it's going to happen. Slowly, like maybe next five years. Yeah, so there we go. So around 200 bucks, that makes sense, because it's like a premium sort of product. Yeah. Yeah. So they get ejected out of the shaft. It's just like Jens Hansen, the jewelers who made the One Ring and Lord of the Rings. Yes, those are great, man. Not the jewelers. I was thinking of the replica swords.

17:20Oh, United Cutlery. Is it? No, but it does. It's true. Really? Yeah. It's amazing. Yeah, they licensed United Cutlery. I'm pretty sure it was United Cutlery. It sounds like shaft utensils. Yeah. To United Cutlery. All sort of field searches for United Cutlery. Yep, yep, yep. It's true. Okay. But they make, here's the thing. I made a big, there's a big delineation. Shaft. Oh crap. There's a big delineation between stuff that United Cutlery makes and other stuff. And by that I mean that United Cutlery's versions are just meant for display.

18:03Oh, okay. So that's why they cost like 124 or 100 something. So they're just meant to be shown off on a plaque on the wall. I get one. Not actual defense against the dark arts. No. Against the armies of Mordor. Yeah. Imagine intruder. Yeah. Aragorn's sword. Yeah. So that's why when we found Aragorn's Anduril, the sword of the king in Slovakia. Yeah. In Slovakia. Yes. Yeah. It was 85 euros because it was damaged a little bit and also because it was a display version. And you missed your opportunity. You missed your opportunity. You were so sad. And I totally missed it. I'm still sad. And now Phil will forever regret he'll be on his deathbed. Oh.

18:43No, no, but here's a silver lining. What if the Nazgul would come and try to steal your watch? There's a silver lining. What will you do? No, no, no. There's a silver lining here. Yes. And that is that Weta makes their own per order swords, you know. That costs about 8,000. It's made by Peter Lyon, who was a blacksmith for the Lord of the Rings swords and for The Hobbit, I guess. And you know how much that would cost you? $300. Sorry. 3,000. Add an extra zero to that. Yeah. 3,000, right? That's not bad for a sword. That's not bad if you're rich. And it would be using the same materials. So you could sword fight with that. Yes, you could.

19:23You could too. So you can get, you can get, what's it called? Anduril, I checked. It was like maybe a 5K. I don't want Anduril. I want Aragorn Strider Sword. Anduril's the best. No, Aragorn Strider Sword. I want, I want the little, the little, what's it called? You want Frodo's, don't you? Sting. Yeah, the little shiv. No, the shiv. Well, I mean, now you have two options. You can get Sting before it had the inscription or. Oh. Is it insider Tolkien stuff? No. No, no. It's just movie stuff. It's just movie stuff. It never had inscriptions. In the, in the book, it never really had an inscription, but they made a little continuity for no reason. No reason whatsoever. Let's get back to the. Let's get back to the. I want to ask you guys what, I kind of missed it last minute.

20:04What do you guys think of Neo and Trinity's sexy pose on the cable? Oh, when he grabs her by the. Yeah. Like, do you think it's good? Do you like it? That's cool. It's just a safety measure. I love that. It's so cash, you know? Yeah. That's, that's what I want to say as well. I think that it's cool because. It's like, he has to kind of hold her there because. But they're like so cool when they do it. It's like Neo just kind of grabs her waist and like they're barely holding on. And they're not, they're not a couple so far. This is like, you know. That's true. Yeah. There's a little tension there. Yeah. A little. I don't know. I didn't think that. Electricity. You didn't think that ever? I just thought, look, we have to get secure. Let's just hold each other for a little bit. Yeah. No way. Why wouldn't they hold each other like friends hold each other, you know?

20:45Yeah. This is sexy. If Morpheus was there, Neo would do the same thing. Fail at it. What, hold him by the waist? No, if it was Morpheus, they would hug each other. That's true. They do. Later on. That's true. That's true. Yeah. We'll get. But anyway, so yeah, this is like, this is like the cool pose, you know. And he says there is no spoon. I just wanted to mention that close up when Tim says that the magic is gone because of the eyes. The what's gone? The magic. Oh. I think it's perfect. I like that you can see his eyes through the, through these sunglasses. I think that was a deliberate thing. Okay. You're asking that question. If it was deliberate. Okay. And he's, he's reiterating, he's echoing the words of the little monk boy that there

21:27is no spoon. And so what do you think that like, you really feel like he's saying that just so he can get past this, uh, this obstacle. It's a weird time to use that. Like what? He's trying to aim better with the gun. There is no spoon. Or is he talking about the, you know, explosion, the, him flying up. What's going on? What's what? No, no, no. What? Here's my take. I'm like, I know. No, no, no. Okay. Let's see. Sorry about that. Master Jake. I apologize. I didn't mean it that way. My take is that, um, this is Neo's call to action. Ah, yes.

22:08Is Neo's call to action? I'm sorry. No, that came up. Um, no, because like the whole idea is that Neo is learning, like we talked about enlightenment. This is the theme, one of the themes in the movie. And I think that Neo is telling himself in this moment because he's facing something that's quite scary, right? Going up the elevator. It's, it's just a dangerous position they're in, right? Yeah. It's a risk, so to speak. Yeah. And it's one of the trials of Hercules. One of the trials, yes. And so he's reminding himself, like, I'm going through with this. Because obviously Neo made the choice to go through this and clearly he's capable of killing cops and army and stuff like that.

22:49And cold blood. Yep. And doing cool moves. Muddo. And, uh, what are they called again? Not somersaults, but the cartwheels. Yeah, cartwheels. All kinds of crazy stuff. Tim, since you weren't here for the last episode. That's right, yeah. I wanted to let you know that in the script, it was a hotel. So when Neo came in, he just shot two cops and, uh, put his gun into the air and shot to the ceiling. Oh, really? So civilians would run away. Oh. I thought you said, like, he shot two cops and put the gun to his temple and shot himself. It's a short movie. He was reminding himself here what the kid told him. There is no spoon. Sort of this idea that, you know, anything is possible and you're not limited by the physical world.

23:31And I would say that, again. And here, literally speaking. Here it's literally, but it's also supposed to be sort of spiritual thing. Okay. That's my opinion. What do you guys think? That's it. Spiritual. They shot that on a green screen and let's move on. Okay. Oh, yeah. So they're going up and now this shot. It's a green screen shot. Let's talk about the shot a little bit. It's not a great shot. What, but holding each other and flying up the shaft? It was probably good in 1999. This is similar. Probably good, you know, when you go to the mall and you go to the electronics store and then you see all these CRT TVs and they're like showing, look how big these CRT TVs and they would play the matrix and you would be like, that is so cool. It's not that bad guys. They even got the light, you know, like flying up. It's not that bad, but I think that we have to, you know, when we're watching the matrix,

24:12we have standards and matrix standards. And so when we're comparing this shot to other shots, we can say it's not as good. I guess. There's worse though. Oh my goodness, guys. What? Is it a double? There is worse. Strings. Do I see them? Where? Could this be? Tim. Yes, it's confirmed. We have some strings that they didn't take out. No, no, it's cables. Oh, you think it's the cables from the? It's just the cables. Okay. From the elevator stuff. Oh, I see what you mean. Anyway. On the right, right? Yeah. Yeah, yeah. I think I might be just trying to. Okay, so anyway, the elevator is going down, they're going up, and as the elevator hits the floor, ding!

24:55Big explosion. Now, this explosion was done technically on, it's a miniature, it's a miniature explosion, and they filmed it upside down. Well, let's take a moment to appreciate this, because I always thought that it was a CG. Explosion? I thought it was a CG door. Fire always looks CG in slow motion. It was a CG. Oh, that's what it is. Yeah. Oh, like, if you look at the famous channel, the slow-mo guys, they have a bunch of fire stuff. Always looks unreal in slow motion. Just, it doesn't make sense. It's like, are what we're used to reality? Did you hear what happened to Gavin? Oh, yeah. Somebody came into his house. Yeah, scary. What? With a gun, and was like, I hate you, Kevin, and your lifestyle, and I want your girlfriend,

25:37and then they called the cops. And they came within four minutes, and that guy walked out and shot himself in the head in the car. Whoa. So, yeah. Sometimes, it's a bit like being a celebrity. Even a small one. Like, you know, YouTube celebrity. Man. That is... That's probably a move house. He... Probably, you know, delusional, most likely. Yeah, yeah. Probably some mental problems. You know... Mental problems. You know what? Have you heard of that case? Travel 11 hours. I don't want to get dark here, but it reminded me. The only other case I know that was like this is crazy is, you know, Bjork, the singer? Yes. Is that her name? Worst name ever. She also had a case like this where this guy was like, you know, completely delusional.

26:19Oh, yeah. The stalker guy. Yeah. You heard about him, right? Yeah. Yeah. He was like sending her stuff, trying to send her bombs and stuff. That's so scary. It is scary. It's absolutely scary. I didn't know it would happen to people like Gavin. Maybe we were going to cut this out. That's fine. It's fine. It's getting a little crazy. This is dark. Okay. Back to the dark and light flashes of the explosions here. Yeah. Anyway. So, this is a miniature, huh? Upside down miniature. Yes. Upside down. Oh, because the flames would then... Yeah. The flames are going... That's so clever. It's not really explosion. It's just like a flame ball. It's pretty cool. Yeah. It's like the goop of flames just going, consuming the whole thing. Was that initial plan or did you just film it and then they were like, what if I flip it? Maybe it was just what they...

27:00Maybe it's just based on... That was the guy in the set. It was based on... What if I flip it? It was based on the look of the concept art and what the Wachowskis wrote. Okay. Okay. So, this is... So, I have a question because like if you look at this shot, on the left-hand side, there's the debris on the floor and for some reason it looks really flat. Is that just an optical illusion or it's... Because you said it's physical, right? It's a physical miniature. The whole thing. Well, I mean, yeah. We saw behind the scenes. What are you talking about? What debris? Bottom left. When the explosion begins, you see the debris on the left. It's like glued on the ceiling. It looks like it's glued. Yeah. It looks like it's flat. Oh, I see.

27:41Yeah, yeah, yeah. I see what you mean. It looks like a Max Payne skin. Yeah. I think it's the fire that goes above it that doesn't do a shadow on it. So, that's why it's freaking out. Ah, yes. But, yeah, looking at it, it could look like, you know, old school CGI. You know what? Maybe it's all just comped. Could be comped. Yeah, maybe they shot the explosion or some kind of different... But the door is definitely CG. That's a CG door. What do you guys think about the door? Because the door does a little bit of a dance here. Yes, it does. It does. The dancey door. The dance of the door. Do you want to know my opinion on the dance of the door? In D minor. What? Distracting? Not distracting. Whenever I saw this movie, and for the longest time, I always thought, like, they're pushing it a little bit here with the dance door.

28:22Because I thought, like, you know, we're going to get... So, six-year-old Jacob's looking at this. They're pushing it with the dance. Not six-year-old, but a little later. It's too much. Too much for my six-year-old brain. You know, you can make other sequences slow motion and cool and cartwheels and stuff like that, but you can't extend it to a door. How are you thinking? Okay. Yeah, like, it's sort of like they're trying to matrixify everything. Because if the door can do this, and the door is a cool explosion where it's bouncing and doing slow motions, like, what's next? It could be anything. Dancing buildings and dancing guns. Like, it could be like, you know... Dancing friends? A building could be bullet-time. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Sure. But I like the door. It adds character to that scene, you know.

29:03It does. It could be just a classic cool explosion scene, but now it has a dancing door. Yeah, because if you think about it, it could have been a boring explosion. And you'd forget about it. But we all remember the dancing door. Yeah. So now... He needs his own Facebook page. Without further ado... Twitter. That's what I did with Jaws... What's his name? Someone's head. Yeah, Gardner's head. Ben Gardner's head. I made a Facebook page for him, like, ages ago. Man. That's amazing. You should bring it back. Bringing it back. Bring it all back. That's the head that scared the crap out of me when I was a kid. Yeah. I was going to say, moving on, that here comes a piece of trivia that I've been saving for a long while.

29:48For the next scene. So the next scene is about agents getting wet. Yes. Now, I have it on good authority. Well, I say good authority. A colleague of mine explained this to me a couple of months back. And I believe him. I know what you're talking about. Go on. Wait, let him speak. I believe him. It is the issue of sprinklers in movies. So we bring back the theme of, is this in real life? No, it's probably not. It's movie logic. You know, this portion of this podcast. So sprinkles don't work like this. Sprinkles are a solitary unit that is operated by pressure.

30:31So what happens here is the bottom floor explosion, right? And then sprinkles on the, let's say, 80th floor, whether the hell they are, turn on. This would not be possible in real life because a sprinkle has... Sprinkler. Sprinkler. Sorry. Has a little membrane. Because a sprinkle is a little yumminess you put on ice cream. And inside, it's the sprinkler that under high pressure, which is created by high heat, explodes and lets the water come out of the pipe. And there is no way to remotely trigger this because it is very, very bad for you because you don't want water on things that don't need water.

31:11You'll destroy equipment. So sprinklers, all of them are exclusively pressure based. They're local. So basically, anything that's happening there, it turns on only at the, you know, just to define... It doesn't turn at all like in the whole building, like in movies, you know, like you always have these guys hacking into the computers. That's why I'm specifying the analog because if it was digital, you could remotely turn them on, but you can't. But they don't want to. They don't need that, you know. By design. Yeah, but by design, they were never made. I don't know how this trope happened in movies. I think it's like many other tropes because in movies, it's more exciting. Like this is like, whoa. I mean, every, especially in the 90s, like in Hackers, remember? He's like, oh, I'm going to hack in and turn on Sprinkles entire school.

31:53Like that's, you know how much water that is? Because I remember you told me about this before. Yeah. You were watching Hackers. Yeah. Like imagine how much water that would be. These pipes, you can't have no way to stop this damn thing, you know? The entire building just flooded for no reason. The whole building... Our company has gone under... Water large. 30 seconds. Yeah. Yeah. All our computers are damp now and broken because there was a minor fire on, you know, one classroom. Like how could a stupid system would that be? That makes a lot of sense. Thank you for sharing this interesting... I'm used for once in a while. Because I didn't know this either. I thought everything's remote. Right. But this makes it a comedy moment.

32:36That is true. So we all appreciate that. And then he's like, sprinklers don't work like this. Yes. Why are we getting sprinkled? Because it's the Matrix. It's not real. Okay, guys. So now we're... We've changed locations entirely. We are now on... Well, well, Agent Smith says find them and destroy them. And then Agent Jones like puts his hand on his temple where his earpiece is. That's what I want to say. He goes... As a response. And he always looks like he's crying. Oh, wait. Was this scene before... Now the water sprinkles will cloak his tears. Wait, wait. So I missed the scene where he goes, he doesn't know. You did. You missed it. What do you want to say about it, Tim? Nothing. Nothing. I'm just... It's a funny scene. It's just like... I love it. He looks like he's about to cry. That's what I want to say. Yeah, yeah. No.

33:16No. We're on the rooftop and a lot of stuff happens on the roof. Like we intro it with Neo head... No. Yeah. Head kicking. Yeah. While holding a gun. While holding... Holding two guns. Two soldiers. It's so good. I love that shot. I love it. That head kick earned them an R. Really? Yeah, pretty much. That head kick. According to Joel Silver, kicks in the head give you R ratings. Wow. It's ridiculous. So bad. Joel Silver, you know, you take what he says with a groin of salt. Yeah. That's really ridiculous. But on the other hand, I love the sort of... Just the jump cut, you know, just like straight into action.

33:57Straight music explosion. Just head kicking around. And I love the lighting. We are under attack. The lighting. I never noticed it. It's so bright. It's so ridiculous looking. Look at this. It's like they're in a soft box of Cloudy City. Yeah. Yeah. Let's start with one trivia here. This is one of the first ever things that they filmed. Oh. Okay. So that's an interesting thing that jumping right into the action and doing some of these moves. Most of this was fairly improvised. If you watch the behind the scenes, you hear it. You can see the Wachowskis like discussing what shots to use and how to space certain things when it comes to shot selections.

34:38And yeah, this was a nice couple of days, I think, up on one of the Sydney buildings. Lovely. Let's point out some stuff. I love the magical 70s zoom on Neo. The guy that Neo's shooting. He just like squips flying out of him. He's like shaking. Let's see it. Let's see it. Well, you're skipping ahead a little bit, Tim. Okay. Let's talk really quick before we get there. Just Don Davis' music, how it sounds like, sounds perfectly, like this is just note for note, a short trip on a big machine. What was it called? It was called... Right. Something like that. You mean that musical piece, orchestral piece? The musical orchestral piece that was highly influential to the score for this film.

35:21Didn't you reference it a while ago? I did, yeah. Okay. A little while ago. Yeah. So this is really similar, huh? Anyway, what I want to say really quick is that we have... What's interesting is that now our heroes are running out of guns as we... That is true. Short ride in the fast machine. That's what it was. That's the one? Nice. And they're running out of guns. So now they're really dependent on things like kung fu. Stealing guns. Kung fu time, yeah. And stealing guns. We haven't had any... Oh, we did. We did. Trinity did most of the kung fu. Yes. Neo just did the double kick. That's true. And after they do a little bit of that stuff, and now Trinity has some guns left, some pistols, we cut to a really bad effect.

36:02Which is the morph. What can you do? The morph of the helicopter pilot to our friend. Agent Jones. It's just... It starts off good. It's just the last bit of morph. It's just weird looking. It's like... Morphy. And didn't John... Yeah. Didn't he also say he hates morphs? Oh, he said, this isn't morphing. We hate morphing. We don't do morphing. And you know, morphing is the 2D... Yeah, the classic. The classic. Then they... Michael Jackson music video, right? Oh, yeah? You know. It's back. It's back. Yeah, well, they invented that for Willow. No. Willow. Morphing. A revolutionary. Like ILM, I think, worked on it, right? Yeah. But it also...

36:43But this isn't morphing. This is like a 3D guy. Why did they make it so bad? They tried. Because that's the best you could do. They tried. But why do the weird... It's good. It's good. It's like it's supposed to be glitchy. You know, Matrix glitchy. Like he's replicating and stuff. But why are there codes? It's beautiful. Look at him. He turns to a dream. That's the question. Why are there codes? Everything is code. Everything must be code. They added in post. Dude, do you know what? Honestly... Okay. But it doesn't make sense to show the code because the code would be... Of course it does. It's for the audience. Made out of codes. Yeah. No. For me, these sequences should be cuts. There's no reason to show everything. Just cut back. Oh, it's an agent now. No. Reloaded. The morphers, I think, is important.

37:24Reloaded, they have a wonderful shot of the cops, like, you know, on the side of the road. They're looking at Trinity and Matrix Reloaded. And then something goes in front of them and they just turn into agents. That's beautiful. No, this happens in the future, like, when they're chasing him later on in the downtown of Chicago. They do the hard cuts. But I think it's important a few times to show that it's like, oh, no, this is very inhuman and disgusting. You know, it's kind of villainizing. The agents are, like, replicating themselves. And you have to see the person being in pain as he's, like, being deleted and, you know, copied this ill form of an agent upon him. This is true. This is true. But... I didn't think about that. After that, there's a hilarious thing.

38:05So, you know, the guy that Trinity chucks the knife at, he is the slowest guy ever. Look at him pick up the gun. Look at... What is he doing? He's doing the dramatic pick up. I'm going to kill you, Neo. Okay, well, let's specify really quick. So, Neo picks up this M16. Yeah, and the camera delves in. It's awesome. It's pushing in. This is Tim was wanting to talk about earlier. Was it a 70s zoom in shot? Yeah. So, there's the camera zooming into this army guy. What are these people, by the way? They're not even army. What are they? They're just city army. It's a city army. Local city army. I don't know what they are. They're a special new troop that they made because of all the Matrix characters. Starship troopers. There's a special army guy getting shot and falling off the roof, presumably. Cuts back to Neo holding the M16 and behind him is the slowest guy.

38:52He's just taking a sweet time picking up his weapon. I'm going to kill you, Neo. Watch this. Well, maybe he's still dazed after getting hit in the head. Yeah, that's true. He's supposed to be the best of the best city army guy. You're right, you're right. He has no excuses. He has no excuses, especially if he's a human being and there's that, you know, adrenaline going in. And so the next shot we see is basically Trinity doesn't throw the knife, but the knife's already there. In the head. But then he leans his head over and reveals it. You revealed the shot. I remember seeing this behind the scenes and I was like, wow, this is so cool. We could do this. Yeah, I was like very impressed by that trick. And you know what? Jake and I did that. Oh, you did it?

39:32You take a next step. It worked pretty well. It is. I think it's like this is a classic trick that totally works. It totally works. And you know how we got the, we didn't have a knife. We had a stick. A stick? Like what are you talking about? Yeah. When we filmed that Kung Fu parody. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And we, instead of having a knife, we had a stick and he just threw the stick at you and we just had you bite down on the stick. Huh, I forgot about that. And it worked. Yeah. I think the reason it works is he just held a stick in his mouth and just pushed his head up. If it's short enough, you'll trick the person. Because we mentioned that it shows, the shot shows Trinity throwing the knife, then it cuts, which creates the illusion that's being thrown.

40:13Yeah. Yep. And then it's revealed that it's on his face. And you know what they would do now? CG knife. CG. CG knife flying through the air. Yeah. And the funny thing is this is way more believable. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Because you see it. I mean, if this was the same trick and then they added the CG knife still there, that like, that would be the best. No. Why would it be worse? No, no, no. You can see an ugly CG knife. No, unless it's a good CG knife. Because a CG knife is so easy to do nowadays, especially in that light. It's just a soft box, you know? I'm skeptical about the CG knife. Did you ever watch a movie from, uh, poop? Why do I know? I don't know names. I never know names. What is it? Explain it though.

40:53Okay. Uh, Mr. Fight Club Man. What's his name? Finchy. Finchy. So, uh, look at Finchy's movies and then look up, uh, CGI and Finch movies. Half of the things are not real in his movies. It's insane. I was, I was, guess what? Okay. So I watched the social network. Yeah. Okay. This is embarrassing. Why? Because, you know, Armie Hammer plays the twins. Yeah. Mm-hmm. And I had no idea. You had no idea. That's what I mean. That's one dude. Oh. I honestly thought it was someone who looks so much like Armie Hammer. It was someone else. Wow. And like, look, look at the rowing scene. Like none of that's real. That's all just CGI. Yeah. That's all in a, but it's convincing. It's convincing. I have no idea.

41:33If you're watching, uh, I think he did the Girl and the Dragon Tattoo. Did he do as well? Yes, he did. He did. He did. And, uh, you watch like, oh, half of the movie is like in snow. And they shot it. There was no snow. It's still fake snow. It's really cool. It's supposed to be supposed. So that's what I mean. Like, like. That's true. It's, if it's, if it's done, not like grotesque, like, oh, well, you know, it can get away with like something like Marvel, you know, in Ant-Man. You're like, oh, of course it's a CGI knife because it's slow motion and everything's big. And you're like, okay with the fantasy, but you can do CGI where it's okay and you don't notice it because it's very grounded. Like it's like basically on effect. The reason why those CGI shots work is not only that they're good, but you're not focusing on them.

42:14Yeah. Unless you're like purposely, like, let's say if this was, you know, uh, Resident Evil, like the knife, you would have like 30 shots of the knife spinning, like, and just like CGI and like 360 and everything. And of course then you notice that it's like a fake CGI knife, but it was like just a few seconds of this shot, like a CGI knife, you wouldn't, you would never pick it up on, you know, that's faker. Even at this day and age. Um, then we have agent, whatever, I forgot his name. Phil knows his name. Do you know his name? Jones. Agent Pants. He walks down, takes two steps. And in the background, you can see Trinity and Neo just kind of like. Chilling. Chilling. And that's that.

42:56That's this minute. You know, there's nothing with the script that's completely different. Maybe we'll, we'll talk about that next minute. But, uh, in this case, uh, the storyboards are, there's a lot of deleted moments with, uh, with them fighting the guards. There's a lot of different moves that were taken out. And there's one special one, which I want to mention where there's a shot that's like 90 degrees up. So it's looking down and it was, it was in between Trinity throwing a knife in the air and that knife was, would be spinning in front of the camera on a 90 degree angle. So looking up and you can see all the, all the players on the, you know, in the background. The players.

43:36All the characters fighting each other. But if it's 90 degrees, we would just see the floor. No, no, no, no. You're looking up. You're up, up, up, up, up, up, up, up. You're up like 20 feet in the air. Oh, I see. The camera's 20 feet in the air looking down. A bird's eye view. A bird's eye view. Bird's eye view. Bird's eye view. And you can see all the characters in slow motion and Trinity, you know, like moved, like threw her knife up and the knife would be in the closeup at, you know, really close to the camera. Oh, I see. And there would be a compass in the butt of the knife, I guess you would call it. And it would be pointing somewhere and it would be in slow motion and then it would drop back down. And then Trinity would grab it and then whoosh and kill someone with it. Exactly what we're talking about. And that shot was recycled for Matrix Revolutions. What?

44:17In Matrix Revolutions, Trinity throws some guns and the guns are, it's the same. It's one gun. It's the same. One gun? Okay. There's just one gun. Yeah. There's one gun that flies into the air when she's in the club with the Merovingian and Morpheus and stuff like that. You know, with all the. He's like causality. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, your gun is flying. And it's a slow motion moment. It's exactly the same. And it looks like CGI, like junk, right? You can just clearly see it's like buttery smoothness. Yeah. But now with CGI, we can do everything. Yeah. We can just like, we can like take the camera and spin it around 360 degrees 10 times. We can have that freedom. Yep.

44:59That's interesting. I didn't know that the knife. Yeah. When I, when I looked at the storyboards, I was like, Hey, that's like Matrix Revolutions. I wonder if they would have pulled that off doing it somehow practically. The classic ball on a stick, you know, like when they do ball fires, you know, you know, you remember like you do like a, let's say you like somebody, let's say this is a baseball movie and somebody like hits the ball. And then what they would do to follow like the POV of the ball, they would like put the ball on a stick and like spin it so it rotates and you have like a really wide angle lens. So that would be the knife. And the ball would be like on the bottom portion of the frame. It's going like flying. Yeah. How do they make it fly though?

45:40Because it's stuck onto the camera. Yeah. It's on the bottom of the frame. Just follow. And then they just spin it, you know, so it looks like it's like flying. It's stuck onto the camera. There's a camera lens. I get it. But where's the camera going? It's like walking around, it's following the ball, like the ball's flying, you know? Oh yeah. I've seen that. Yeah. I've seen that. Yeah. It's classic. It's like a POV of the ball, but with the ball there. Yeah. It's like a third person, like a third person shooter ball. That's pretty cheesy though. Yeah. You don't do that. Don't want to do that. Put the knife on the stick. The good thing about Trinity's knife throw, even in the alternate version, when she throws it up and the camera looks at it, is that that guy will still be slow. So it's great. It'll be just so he gets killed. He gets killed. Yeah. Oh no.

46:21And that's it. The best thing would be probably when that guy got the gun, he probably would still have to reload it. So plenty of time. Plenty of time to kill him. I think that's it. Do you have anything to add? Nah. There's a low angle shot of the agent's feet coming towards. Where were you? Huh? Huh? I mentioned that. Oh, you mentioned that. Okay. And there's a shot of Trinity looking like, getting a little scared. Yeah, I mentioned it. I said they were chilling. That's really not the same emotion. That's right. And then there's a shot of Neo turning his back somehow. So he has something, something planned. Does he? Prepared. We'll see in the next episode. He will show himself, reveal himself in all his manly glory.

47:03Dear listener. Skin on skin. Thank you for being with us today on the Matrix Minute. I hope we've been able to be fun to hang out with. Oh yeah, we haven't done this in a while. Twitter, at the Matrix Minute. Wow. Right? Yes. Tim. Yes. I'm proud of you. You are promoting. Yeah. Yes. We have a website, thematrixminute.one. You can email us at ask at the matrixminute.one. You can send us requests. You can send us comments, anything there.

47:44If you use iTunes, we would love if you give it a review. It helps a lot to get new listeners. And if you would be so kind to leave us a rating, it would be cool too. Yeah, that's awesome as well. Maybe also if you feel like a little review, a little mini review. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That'd be awesome. Put a little review there. And then we have a Facebook group where some listeners, not a lot, but a few, sometimes leave a comment, maybe a discussion going on. So that's also lovely as well. So if you listen to this podcast and like to get more involved, maybe, we are open. Yeah. We still, you know, check things out. Always, you know, we're checking stuff and we're always around those places and always trying to post stuff for you guys out there. And the Twitter also, if you noticed, we try to post some photos and Phil posts behind

48:31the scenes photos and little bits of trivia. Yeah, yeah. So if you really, you know, like that kind of stuff, go check out the Twitter. There's a bunch of content there. Even though content's not a good word, but you know what I mean. Condiments. Nice. That's a better word. Thank you, everyone. And we'll see you in the next Matrix Minute. Oh, it shows you, Shaft.